My sons still play. They started with me as tweens. Still using the second edition. My youngest's gaming group started in high school, continued thru college, and continues in his thirties. Some of the folks changed out and one guy brings his spouse. The pup says she's a better player than hubbie.
ACKS II (Adventurer Conqueror King System -- Imperial Imprint) is out there for a new take on old D&D. And everything has been engineered for verisimilitude: an actual world that functions to exist in and to change based on what you do.
GURPS - lots of older editions of things available, and just about any game world you like either has a source book or you can convert yourself pretty easily.
D&D - nothing after 3rd edition was worth much of anything (We mostly quit after 2nd edition).
Talislanta has some cool stuff for background, but some of the character types can get a little repetitive after a bit.
BattleTech can be pretty cool.
ShadowRun (the older stuff - again not the newer editions) was pretty solid.
GURPS should be purchased secondhand, as Steve Jackson Games has used their brands to fundraise for the Lilith Fund, and Steve Jackson himself definitely hates those on the American Right.
May I point out that there are plenty of copies of the original D & D Books out there that I played in the 1980's and sold at my store during the 1980's and there is absolutely no requirement that anyone both buying this woke trash.
Likewise with Warhammer and likewise with Magic cards. Just buy the old stuff used stuff and keep playing the games and let them all wonder why the 2nd hand stores are getting the business as they all rot on the vine.
Why does any of this surprise you? We've spent several generations teaching our kids (and ourselves) that we don't need no stinking rules, laws are made to be broken, manners are for prigs, morals are for prudes, and whatever you want you should have because you're just so, so special.
When anything goes, everything goes.
We're a culture/civilization heading deep into decadence and our situation, like other cultures/civilizations headed into decadence is right on schedule.
This too will pass.
Remember your Voltaire: “History is only the pattern of silken slippers descending the stairs to the thunder of hobnailed boots climbing upward from below.”
Our replacements -- and yes, our children and grandchildren will suffer -- will look upon our culture/civilization with shock and horror.
ACKs - Adventurer , Conqueror, King system, by Alexander Macris, also deserves mention. The rules, based in old-school D&D but expanded to allow everything through running kingdoms, scale well. You don't need to look up the fancy stuff until you've spent the time to get there and master the basics.
D&D has wandered far from the original ideas that spawned it, and in my mind it all began when Gary Gygax was ousted from TSR. (Not that there haven’t been good products since, but once the founder is gone so is the driving vision.)
In 1989 I attended a convention where Gary Gygax and Frank Mentzer were guests, and I asked them why they left TSR three years earlier. Still angry about being forced out, Mr. Gygax told me that his ex-wife had been sleeping with Lorraine William’s lawyer and she sold the stock she got in the divorce to help tip the scales against him.
Further, he said she assisted the other side in the lawsuit he filed to stop the sale of the Blume’s stock to Williams, since they had a verbal agreement giving him right of first purchase should they ever sell their stock. He said her testimony was key to the lawsuit going against him, so once the stock sale went through and his rivals had controlling interest, he found himself fired from his own company. Mr. Mentzer resigned in protest.
I’m not saying this was 100% what happened, but this is what Mr. Gygax told me himself. RIP to the co-founder of the modern role-playing game.
I learned D&D with AD&D 2e in the late 90s, played faithfully through 3e, 3.5, and 4e. The announcement of fifth edition, and the watered-down nonsense that launched in 2014, sent me to Pathfinder for my d20 fix.
Watching people try to credit 5e's garbage play for bringing massive numbers of people into the hobby, and not the overproduced likes of Critical Role, has just made me laugh. Pathfinder 2nd edition is now my favorite game.
Paizo (Pathfinder's creator and publisher, for those not in the know) is not innocent. Their employees still have pronounces in their bios, and copious nose rings; and there are lots of dyed-in-the-wool lefties in positions of power in the company. But the game itself is solid, and the weird sex things are niche enough, still, to be ignored. And, frankly, their track record over the last few years has been pretty positive, at least with regard to actually listening to feedback from their audience.
"Of course none of this is all that surprising, considering the theatre kids at WotC have shaved any and all sharp edges from the property in recent years, with an especially concerted effort taking place for fifth edition . . . nothing more effectively sums up how utterly neutered the game has become quite as much as the art that’s surfaced for fifth edition’s various abominations over the years." Um, I think you mean sixth edition. The fifth was published in 2014.
Correct, it was, and while significant updates were published since its release, there has not as of yet been a full numbered release since to officially replace it.
I bought most of the stuff I did for things like maps and story ideas, and ignore the woke BS. If they don't put out anything I want to use, there's always other sources.
My sons still play. They started with me as tweens. Still using the second edition. My youngest's gaming group started in high school, continued thru college, and continues in his thirties. Some of the folks changed out and one guy brings his spouse. The pup says she's a better player than hubbie.
Good post.
ACKS II (Adventurer Conqueror King System -- Imperial Imprint) is out there for a new take on old D&D. And everything has been engineered for verisimilitude: an actual world that functions to exist in and to change based on what you do.
GURPS - lots of older editions of things available, and just about any game world you like either has a source book or you can convert yourself pretty easily.
D&D - nothing after 3rd edition was worth much of anything (We mostly quit after 2nd edition).
Talislanta has some cool stuff for background, but some of the character types can get a little repetitive after a bit.
BattleTech can be pretty cool.
ShadowRun (the older stuff - again not the newer editions) was pretty solid.
Thanks, Tiffany!
GURPS should be purchased secondhand, as Steve Jackson Games has used their brands to fundraise for the Lilith Fund, and Steve Jackson himself definitely hates those on the American Right.
Hi, I had never heard that.
But, as I said, we prefer all the older version anyway.
May I point out that there are plenty of copies of the original D & D Books out there that I played in the 1980's and sold at my store during the 1980's and there is absolutely no requirement that anyone both buying this woke trash.
Likewise with Warhammer and likewise with Magic cards. Just buy the old stuff used stuff and keep playing the games and let them all wonder why the 2nd hand stores are getting the business as they all rot on the vine.
Why does any of this surprise you? We've spent several generations teaching our kids (and ourselves) that we don't need no stinking rules, laws are made to be broken, manners are for prigs, morals are for prudes, and whatever you want you should have because you're just so, so special.
When anything goes, everything goes.
We're a culture/civilization heading deep into decadence and our situation, like other cultures/civilizations headed into decadence is right on schedule.
This too will pass.
Remember your Voltaire: “History is only the pattern of silken slippers descending the stairs to the thunder of hobnailed boots climbing upward from below.”
Our replacements -- and yes, our children and grandchildren will suffer -- will look upon our culture/civilization with shock and horror.
ACKs - Adventurer , Conqueror, King system, by Alexander Macris, also deserves mention. The rules, based in old-school D&D but expanded to allow everything through running kingdoms, scale well. You don't need to look up the fancy stuff until you've spent the time to get there and master the basics.
D&D has wandered far from the original ideas that spawned it, and in my mind it all began when Gary Gygax was ousted from TSR. (Not that there haven’t been good products since, but once the founder is gone so is the driving vision.)
In 1989 I attended a convention where Gary Gygax and Frank Mentzer were guests, and I asked them why they left TSR three years earlier. Still angry about being forced out, Mr. Gygax told me that his ex-wife had been sleeping with Lorraine William’s lawyer and she sold the stock she got in the divorce to help tip the scales against him.
Further, he said she assisted the other side in the lawsuit he filed to stop the sale of the Blume’s stock to Williams, since they had a verbal agreement giving him right of first purchase should they ever sell their stock. He said her testimony was key to the lawsuit going against him, so once the stock sale went through and his rivals had controlling interest, he found himself fired from his own company. Mr. Mentzer resigned in protest.
I’m not saying this was 100% what happened, but this is what Mr. Gygax told me himself. RIP to the co-founder of the modern role-playing game.
OG AD&D. Appendix N. And yes, MtG.
Keep the old, OG games alive *and* support the new creators.
Codex's codicil: once the skin suit is visibly rotting, the SJWs will try to convince you the institution they gutted was always thus.
I learned D&D with AD&D 2e in the late 90s, played faithfully through 3e, 3.5, and 4e. The announcement of fifth edition, and the watered-down nonsense that launched in 2014, sent me to Pathfinder for my d20 fix.
Watching people try to credit 5e's garbage play for bringing massive numbers of people into the hobby, and not the overproduced likes of Critical Role, has just made me laugh. Pathfinder 2nd edition is now my favorite game.
Paizo (Pathfinder's creator and publisher, for those not in the know) is not innocent. Their employees still have pronounces in their bios, and copious nose rings; and there are lots of dyed-in-the-wool lefties in positions of power in the company. But the game itself is solid, and the weird sex things are niche enough, still, to be ignored. And, frankly, their track record over the last few years has been pretty positive, at least with regard to actually listening to feedback from their audience.
Does the party run from the zombie? Maybe the cleric can turn it. No, wait, the bard is going to hump it instead. And all is well. /sarc
I'm so glad I switched from running D&D to Savage Worlds a couple of years back.
Play BECMI All my D&D stuff comes from the 20th century, i still have a collection of Dragon magazines, and i'm fine with it.
"Of course none of this is all that surprising, considering the theatre kids at WotC have shaved any and all sharp edges from the property in recent years, with an especially concerted effort taking place for fifth edition . . . nothing more effectively sums up how utterly neutered the game has become quite as much as the art that’s surfaced for fifth edition’s various abominations over the years." Um, I think you mean sixth edition. The fifth was published in 2014.
Correct, it was, and while significant updates were published since its release, there has not as of yet been a full numbered release since to officially replace it.
Also speaking of alternatives...
You're. Not. Canon.
https://youtu.be/pp-f--sloe8?si=YgVdt8Q_hI5bTcp1
Praise be to Space King!
Just going to say a lot of this can be cross checked and confirmed in Chuck's history of MTG and D&D.
https://sfdebris.com/videos/special/timeofwizards01.php
https://sfdebris.com/videos/special/timeofdragons01.php
I bought most of the stuff I did for things like maps and story ideas, and ignore the woke BS. If they don't put out anything I want to use, there's always other sources.