I've read pretty much all of the High Republic books to date, some points you make might carry weight but a lot of them are simply wrong, like this:
"The decision to have it take place during a period of peace and prosperity in the republic speaks to the creatively stunted minds behind the effort who fear tension"
Have you even read a single book? The whole point of the series is it's set in a peaceful time to show the stark contrast with what happens through the series, even in the first book.
Many Jedi die, most of them quite horribly. "Into the Dark" is almost more of a horror book. There is no lack of tension to be found.
As you point out some of the authors have chosen to be political about things, but that only rarely comes out in the books themselves, and not really in any meaningful way.
I personally think any Star Wars fan is doing themselves a disservice not reading these series - if you are one of those who didn't like the sequel trilogy, well none of that is in here! A lot of the Jedi are really interesting, the way they describing seeing and working with the Force is really interesting, and frankly yes even that rock (Geode) is really interesting in the best kind of campy fun way that some Star Wars aliens have. And the ways the Jedi are attacked harken back to the classic Thrawn books we all love.
Also calling the bad guys "the Nihil" and claiming they are generic misses the point that the central bad guy is REALLY Marchion Ro, much more interesting than some some generic mob because he has longer term plans and deeper motives than the group he leads.
For anyone at all interested in the series I would at least read "Light Of The Jedi", and see what you think - you could also just read selected books if certain authors bother you, you do not have to read every one. Personally I thought this whole series was almost more of a callback to more classic Star Wars.
Also sales numbers always trail off for later books in a series, the real problem I feel like for HR books is that there were so many in Phase One, it turned off quite a few people even if interested because there would be so much to read... over time I think sales will improve somewhat for phase 2, and I think phase three might actually fare kind of well as it closes things out, and things get more interesting from phase 1. But again, if you are not reading because of the sheer number, just pick an author or two you like and read some of those.
I honestly never could get into any of the Star Wars ephemera. Only one I can remember actually reading was Alan Dean Foster's "Splinter of the Mind's Eye", and that was it. The rest of the "Extended Universe" struck me, even as a teenager/20-something as cash grabs with limited to no value.
And, to be quite honest? That's all of Star Wars. In some alternate universe, they stopped at the one homage to the old serials, and that was it. Just the original.
Visually? It was amazing. The storytelling, the guts of the supposed "science fiction"? No there was there, ever. If you go looking for a consistent storyline, or coherent thought in any of the Star Wars movies and books, you'll lose your damn mind. I mean... Midichlorians? Darth Vader as Luke's father? WTF, man? I swear to God, the world would be a much better place if someone had just told George Lucas that the only thing he'd be allowed to do would be the visuals. His plotting is non-existent, the world-building is incoherent, and... Gah. It had so much potential, but... It was never realized.
They could have filmed so many other books as blockbusters instead of Star Wars. Anything by Vernor Vinge, for example.
People say to me "I love science fiction! Star Wars was the greatest!!", and I'm unable to take them seriously as much of anything. I want real meat, consistency, and some damn rationality in my plotting and worldbuilding... Which just ain't there, anywhere in the Star Wars canon. I mean, the sheer amount of crap they stole, filed the serial numbers off of, and then sold as "original"? Yeesh. Academy Awards? They should have gotten prison time for grand theft plot device. You can claim that quip about "good artists copy, great artists steal...", but there's the minor little problem of Star Wars not being great art.
Commercially successful? No doubt. Good? Oh, hell to the no...
" I want real meat, consistency, and some damn rationality in my plotting and worldbuilding... Which just ain't there, anywhere in the Star Wars canon. "
Awful lot of judgment coming from a guy who who remembers reading a single Star Wars book.... and that being Splinter.
The reason I love and have stuck with Star Wars ever since the original, is exactly because there is no other world building effort that even comes close to it. If you read through the many, many Star Wars books - EU or not - there is a ton of meat, consistency, and rationality to be found, again I would say more than in any other SF (or fantasy) franchise that exists.
Did you even read the original (or newer) Thrawn trilogy? I just don't see how you can say those things, having read those... or any Star Wars book by Delilah S. Dawson.
I would agree that Star Wars is not for everyone, but could never agree it lacks the depth you seem to think it does... it is after all, a whole universe of content and the fact so many Star Wars books are produced even now shows just how powerful and rich that universe is.
The entirety of that "universe" is derivative schlock written by some of the worst and least consistent writers in the history of writing. I've tried reading the majority of the "Expanded Universe", but the willing suspension of disbelief required is way more than I possess. I don't think I've gotten more than a few pages into any of that crap before I realized that I'd seen it before, somewhere else, and done far better. The real problem is the base they're forced to work from; magical "force", in a science fiction setting? Ain't buying it. You want inexplicable hand-waved psionic powers? In a setting with star travel? Repeating myself, *not* buying it. Campbell couldn't sell it to me with his original versions, by actual decent authors.
What's worse, the so-called "Expanded Universe" is mostly gratuitous self-insert fanfiction. You can identify the Mary Sues almost within the first five pages, and they're not even well-done Mary Sues. I once had the signal displeasure of being forced into trying to read a lot of that schlock when there was only boxes and boxes of donated Star Wars books at an interminable stopover during a deployment; I had nothing else. And, after a couple of days of desperately going through those boxes, I was reluctantly forced to conclude that I really had nothing at all to read.
My standard for "good science fiction" is something like Vernor Vinge with "A Deepness in the Sky" or David Brin's "Uplift" series. The majority of Star Wars doesn't even begin to meet that standard, in terms of anything: It started out as an attempt at recreating the old Flash Gordon or Buck Rodgers serials of the 1930s and 1940s, conceived of by a man whose idea of what science fiction is never progressed much past that. George Lucas displays an understanding of the genre that ended about the time of the serials, and really only of the surface visuals. He's ripped off nearly every major author and director, filed off the serial numbers, misunderstood most of it, and then put it on display as visual eye candy. Which he's good at, I have to admit; the plotting and worldbuilding is where he sucks ass. Without Leigh Brackett and his wife helping out, the first trilogy would have been an utter wasteland, and you can tell he didn't have anyone equivalent on the later movies to tell him "No, George... This doesn't work. Not now, not ever..."
And, it shows: Midichlorians? Where'd that come from? All the inconsistencies of the original trilogy between everything else?
Star Wars started out as an homage to the old serials, and the sad fact is, it never rose above the original material. The people behind it never did any real thinking about how to flesh it out consistently or with any logic at all. It's all visual, all the time, and in order to even begin to enjoy it, you have to turn your brain off.
Which ain't why I read science fiction. I want some thoughts to be provoked, some new ideas, some projections about the implications of things. You don't get that with Star Wars; all it is is pure escapist dreck produced by people who only see the outward forms, not the inward implications in the deeps.
I mean, for the love of God, what about any of the "Jedi Knights" makes the least little bit of sense? An order (so we are informed by the later movies) that requires celibacy and lack of attachment to other people, yet posits such creatures as selfless and self-sacrificing? No family connections, having had them severed in early life, and yet we're to believe they all willingly martyr themselves for the greater good? WTF? Does that ring true with any humans, ever? Even the Knights Templar didn't demand that from its members...
George Lucas is someone who gives off severe Asperger Syndrome vibes; he does not, at a fundamental level, really understand or relate to other people very well. Which is why his dialogue and plotting suck, and his visuals stun. I appreciate his visual art, but the rest of it...? Yeesh. High fantasy in a science fiction setting with *starships*? I'd need a damn lobotomy to really be able to get into it.
What's sad is that there was a lot of potential there, which could have been realized, and still made some modicum of sense. Meld in Vinge's sensor-effector nanites with THE FORCE, and instead of silly-ass inconsistent and entirely nutty "midichlorians", simply make the "force sensitive" people whose gene patterns or whatever pass the security protocols for the ubiquitous nanite swarms that are everywhere in the setting... I mean, at least make an attempt at staying within the conventions of the genre, eh?
Like I said... I simply don't possess the required quantities of disbelief to be able to enjoy any of it past the first movies, and then only on a visual level. Ya wanna sell me on a work about a magical system? Give me consistency and some logic; don't try to include science and starships in any of it. I'd buy a lot of the Star Wars canon were it in a high fantasy setting, but not where George Lucas put it.
This is a fantastic article, very thorough! I was looking to do a follow up to this article on a You Tube video and compare to the cumulative sales data of the Expanded Universe books of old. Do you have, or are you able to obtain data for the old EU sales figures? I have tried contacting the publisher via phone, email and Twitter and have gotten no response. Your source material, research information and this article would be credited and referenced. Any help would be much appreciated. Thanks! Keep up the good work.
I've read pretty much all of the High Republic books to date, some points you make might carry weight but a lot of them are simply wrong, like this:
"The decision to have it take place during a period of peace and prosperity in the republic speaks to the creatively stunted minds behind the effort who fear tension"
Have you even read a single book? The whole point of the series is it's set in a peaceful time to show the stark contrast with what happens through the series, even in the first book.
Many Jedi die, most of them quite horribly. "Into the Dark" is almost more of a horror book. There is no lack of tension to be found.
As you point out some of the authors have chosen to be political about things, but that only rarely comes out in the books themselves, and not really in any meaningful way.
I personally think any Star Wars fan is doing themselves a disservice not reading these series - if you are one of those who didn't like the sequel trilogy, well none of that is in here! A lot of the Jedi are really interesting, the way they describing seeing and working with the Force is really interesting, and frankly yes even that rock (Geode) is really interesting in the best kind of campy fun way that some Star Wars aliens have. And the ways the Jedi are attacked harken back to the classic Thrawn books we all love.
Also calling the bad guys "the Nihil" and claiming they are generic misses the point that the central bad guy is REALLY Marchion Ro, much more interesting than some some generic mob because he has longer term plans and deeper motives than the group he leads.
For anyone at all interested in the series I would at least read "Light Of The Jedi", and see what you think - you could also just read selected books if certain authors bother you, you do not have to read every one. Personally I thought this whole series was almost more of a callback to more classic Star Wars.
Also sales numbers always trail off for later books in a series, the real problem I feel like for HR books is that there were so many in Phase One, it turned off quite a few people even if interested because there would be so much to read... over time I think sales will improve somewhat for phase 2, and I think phase three might actually fare kind of well as it closes things out, and things get more interesting from phase 1. But again, if you are not reading because of the sheer number, just pick an author or two you like and read some of those.
I honestly never could get into any of the Star Wars ephemera. Only one I can remember actually reading was Alan Dean Foster's "Splinter of the Mind's Eye", and that was it. The rest of the "Extended Universe" struck me, even as a teenager/20-something as cash grabs with limited to no value.
And, to be quite honest? That's all of Star Wars. In some alternate universe, they stopped at the one homage to the old serials, and that was it. Just the original.
Visually? It was amazing. The storytelling, the guts of the supposed "science fiction"? No there was there, ever. If you go looking for a consistent storyline, or coherent thought in any of the Star Wars movies and books, you'll lose your damn mind. I mean... Midichlorians? Darth Vader as Luke's father? WTF, man? I swear to God, the world would be a much better place if someone had just told George Lucas that the only thing he'd be allowed to do would be the visuals. His plotting is non-existent, the world-building is incoherent, and... Gah. It had so much potential, but... It was never realized.
They could have filmed so many other books as blockbusters instead of Star Wars. Anything by Vernor Vinge, for example.
People say to me "I love science fiction! Star Wars was the greatest!!", and I'm unable to take them seriously as much of anything. I want real meat, consistency, and some damn rationality in my plotting and worldbuilding... Which just ain't there, anywhere in the Star Wars canon. I mean, the sheer amount of crap they stole, filed the serial numbers off of, and then sold as "original"? Yeesh. Academy Awards? They should have gotten prison time for grand theft plot device. You can claim that quip about "good artists copy, great artists steal...", but there's the minor little problem of Star Wars not being great art.
Commercially successful? No doubt. Good? Oh, hell to the no...
" I want real meat, consistency, and some damn rationality in my plotting and worldbuilding... Which just ain't there, anywhere in the Star Wars canon. "
Awful lot of judgment coming from a guy who who remembers reading a single Star Wars book.... and that being Splinter.
The reason I love and have stuck with Star Wars ever since the original, is exactly because there is no other world building effort that even comes close to it. If you read through the many, many Star Wars books - EU or not - there is a ton of meat, consistency, and rationality to be found, again I would say more than in any other SF (or fantasy) franchise that exists.
Did you even read the original (or newer) Thrawn trilogy? I just don't see how you can say those things, having read those... or any Star Wars book by Delilah S. Dawson.
I would agree that Star Wars is not for everyone, but could never agree it lacks the depth you seem to think it does... it is after all, a whole universe of content and the fact so many Star Wars books are produced even now shows just how powerful and rich that universe is.
Depth? Richness? In Star Wars? LOL...
The entirety of that "universe" is derivative schlock written by some of the worst and least consistent writers in the history of writing. I've tried reading the majority of the "Expanded Universe", but the willing suspension of disbelief required is way more than I possess. I don't think I've gotten more than a few pages into any of that crap before I realized that I'd seen it before, somewhere else, and done far better. The real problem is the base they're forced to work from; magical "force", in a science fiction setting? Ain't buying it. You want inexplicable hand-waved psionic powers? In a setting with star travel? Repeating myself, *not* buying it. Campbell couldn't sell it to me with his original versions, by actual decent authors.
What's worse, the so-called "Expanded Universe" is mostly gratuitous self-insert fanfiction. You can identify the Mary Sues almost within the first five pages, and they're not even well-done Mary Sues. I once had the signal displeasure of being forced into trying to read a lot of that schlock when there was only boxes and boxes of donated Star Wars books at an interminable stopover during a deployment; I had nothing else. And, after a couple of days of desperately going through those boxes, I was reluctantly forced to conclude that I really had nothing at all to read.
My standard for "good science fiction" is something like Vernor Vinge with "A Deepness in the Sky" or David Brin's "Uplift" series. The majority of Star Wars doesn't even begin to meet that standard, in terms of anything: It started out as an attempt at recreating the old Flash Gordon or Buck Rodgers serials of the 1930s and 1940s, conceived of by a man whose idea of what science fiction is never progressed much past that. George Lucas displays an understanding of the genre that ended about the time of the serials, and really only of the surface visuals. He's ripped off nearly every major author and director, filed off the serial numbers, misunderstood most of it, and then put it on display as visual eye candy. Which he's good at, I have to admit; the plotting and worldbuilding is where he sucks ass. Without Leigh Brackett and his wife helping out, the first trilogy would have been an utter wasteland, and you can tell he didn't have anyone equivalent on the later movies to tell him "No, George... This doesn't work. Not now, not ever..."
And, it shows: Midichlorians? Where'd that come from? All the inconsistencies of the original trilogy between everything else?
Star Wars started out as an homage to the old serials, and the sad fact is, it never rose above the original material. The people behind it never did any real thinking about how to flesh it out consistently or with any logic at all. It's all visual, all the time, and in order to even begin to enjoy it, you have to turn your brain off.
Which ain't why I read science fiction. I want some thoughts to be provoked, some new ideas, some projections about the implications of things. You don't get that with Star Wars; all it is is pure escapist dreck produced by people who only see the outward forms, not the inward implications in the deeps.
I mean, for the love of God, what about any of the "Jedi Knights" makes the least little bit of sense? An order (so we are informed by the later movies) that requires celibacy and lack of attachment to other people, yet posits such creatures as selfless and self-sacrificing? No family connections, having had them severed in early life, and yet we're to believe they all willingly martyr themselves for the greater good? WTF? Does that ring true with any humans, ever? Even the Knights Templar didn't demand that from its members...
George Lucas is someone who gives off severe Asperger Syndrome vibes; he does not, at a fundamental level, really understand or relate to other people very well. Which is why his dialogue and plotting suck, and his visuals stun. I appreciate his visual art, but the rest of it...? Yeesh. High fantasy in a science fiction setting with *starships*? I'd need a damn lobotomy to really be able to get into it.
What's sad is that there was a lot of potential there, which could have been realized, and still made some modicum of sense. Meld in Vinge's sensor-effector nanites with THE FORCE, and instead of silly-ass inconsistent and entirely nutty "midichlorians", simply make the "force sensitive" people whose gene patterns or whatever pass the security protocols for the ubiquitous nanite swarms that are everywhere in the setting... I mean, at least make an attempt at staying within the conventions of the genre, eh?
Like I said... I simply don't possess the required quantities of disbelief to be able to enjoy any of it past the first movies, and then only on a visual level. Ya wanna sell me on a work about a magical system? Give me consistency and some logic; don't try to include science and starships in any of it. I'd buy a lot of the Star Wars canon were it in a high fantasy setting, but not where George Lucas put it.
This is a fantastic article, very thorough! I was looking to do a follow up to this article on a You Tube video and compare to the cumulative sales data of the Expanded Universe books of old. Do you have, or are you able to obtain data for the old EU sales figures? I have tried contacting the publisher via phone, email and Twitter and have gotten no response. Your source material, research information and this article would be credited and referenced. Any help would be much appreciated. Thanks! Keep up the good work.
What about digital sales?